How to outsmart demomen with Chargin Targe

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Postby Purplecat » Thu Dec 24, 2009 10:53 pm

vlcsnap-2009-12-24-23h48m48s136.jpg
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Bullet

Seriously guys it's not that hard. I see too many people who try to counter targe with explosives, and then wonder why they fail.

A heavy works wonders against targe demomen. A sentry gun stops a targe demoman in his track, assuming the sentry isn't easily reachable by his grenade launcher. Scouts being the main anti-class of demoman have a even larger advantage towards targe demomen, especially if they use the FAN. Despite the flame resistance, smart pyros who can actually use airblast can just airblast the poor scot around as he swings his sword again.

Major updates do have their balance issues, and I expect that we can see a few balance tweaks in the coming month. I hope Valve is waiting on the soldier+demoman thing dies down before doing balancing. And I'm kinda sad seeing whining over a weapon I personally have a easy time to counter.
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Postby iller » Thu Dec 24, 2009 11:10 pm

...even I've gotten a few Axetinguisher kills off on Targe Demos and my reaction times are literally 100's of ms slower than everyone else's in busy areas...

They're still pretty tough to counter on a Soldier though if you're running Gunboats or BuffBanner instead of shotty... :|
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Postby Arcalane » Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:45 am

I'll note that whilst a direct rocket hit to them won't do much damage, it will stop a charge dead in it's tracks. It's so fun to watch them run at you only to get blocked... or even crockblocked. ;)

Remember kids, if you don't have the shotgun, there's always juggling and Defensive Rocketjumping if they're trying to melee you. They can't hit you if they are being propelled away by the physics effect of the explosion - which is something the Targe doesn't protect against.

For those of you unfamiliar with the concept of a defensive rocketjump, just backpedal and rocketjump when an enemy is attempting to melee you. Ideally and done correctly, this propels both of you away from each other in opposite directions with a decent amount of speed. Less optimally, it blows you up. Occasionally, it may blow both of you up. In any case, use the period whilst you and/or they are in the air to shotgun them, reload, make peace with your chosen deity or deities, or otherwise make the most of the distance it gives you, if any.
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Postby Makaze » Fri Jan 01, 2010 7:11 pm

iller wrote:...even I've gotten a few Axetinguisher kills off on Targe Demos and my reaction times are literally 100's of ms slower than everyone else's in busy areas...

They're still pretty tough to counter on a Soldier though if you're running Gunboats or BuffBanner instead of shotty... :|


That is satisfying ain't it. Hearing their 40K Orcish "WAAAAAUG" as they charge you, light em up a little, then get to swining like a canadian lumberjack. Well also sidestepping helps while you prep all this
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Postby CrashFu » Wed Jan 20, 2010 2:14 am

I haven't played since... like... a week after that update came out, so the following might no longer be an issue:

Person playing with a fixed mouse sensitivity rate set at a level physically possible to AIM GUNS WITH: Can barely change direction whatsoever while chargin' with their targe.

Person using script to jack mouse sensitivity up to levels where a pixel's worth of movement equals a 360-THOUSAND degree turn while they're charging: Compensate for the decreased maneuverability and become able to turn rapidly while running around.



What was UP with that? I thought Valve had learned not to implement any kind of game-balancing hindrance that could be casually removed with the simplest of scripts or modifications. They added reticles back to unscoped sniper rifles when they figured out everyone was putting sticky-tack on their monitors, but they couldn't figure out that making your maneuverability drop during a charge ONLY punishes those of us who play the game straight/vanilla/as-intended/whatever-it-is-you-kids-are-calling-a-lack-of-scripts-these-days?
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Postby iller » Wed Jan 20, 2010 4:34 am

Some guy did a 45 degree turn mid-charge right into me on Granary yesterday I was like "WTF is up with that??"...
Thanks for the info, Now I know how he did it. ...and knowing is half the battle
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Postby Gami » Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:22 pm

people who use those kind of scripts are sad to begin with, although i haven't seen it personally yet
not that it even sounds very usefull but okay still kinda cheap..>>
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Postby pablofiasco » Wed Jan 20, 2010 9:53 pm

airblast to stop/back them up
firepuff to set them ablace
critaxe to finish them off

i WANT chargin targe to get close to me >:3
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Postby CrashFu » Thu Jan 21, 2010 12:15 am

Gami wrote:people who use those kind of scripts are sad to begin with, although i haven't seen it personally yet
not that it even sounds very usefull but okay still kinda cheap..>>


Not useful? If you're using the targe with normal sensitivity, you just cruise along in a more or less straight line, easy prey for incoming fire and very easy to sidestip. If you jack your sensitivity up to compensate, you get to maneuver as normal, which means you can go all serpentine to make it harder to get shot, and sidestepping you becomes not-an-option.
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Postby iller » Thu Jan 21, 2010 12:39 am

Useful or not, they're still BYPASSING the weapon's #1 Drawback. It'd be like staying in 1st-person while using bonk and being able to attack at the same time. Or being able to Zoom in FOV to 30 with the Huntsman or Ambassador... VALVe designs Drawbacks into weapons for a reason. Targe is already OP when used with Pipes, removing its only drawback from the charge sequence is just strait up penalizing anyone who plays Heavy, Pyro, or Engie (corner turning intel grabs).
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