Spawn camping

[caigan]

[kodani]

[Witchiebunny]

No admins.

So when the servers need updating, there's a group vote to do so?

When the servers need restarting, or the plugin breaks for whatever reason, you get a group vote to fix it?

And that's just the technical aspects, not even going into the social aspects of why admins are needed on a server.

That suggestion honestly tells me your expectations of a server and of a community (especially of this size) and of running a game server are at the very least *somewhat* unrealistic, to put it diplomatically.

[NikkyVix]

[Witchiebunny]

Also, I would argue if you need to spawncamp in order to be effective, as you claim, then the flaw lies not in our spawncamping rules but in your playing ability.

[Helios]

[Purplecat]

I would argue that situations where spawncamping is effective as a tactic is quite rare, and in most cases it's a assholish thing to do, because the spawn is far away from the map objective in those cases (like, the RED spawns on dustbowl).

Just plain don't do spawncamping, it's not fun for the ones spawncamped. And for that and various other reasons, we simple do not allow it.

[Funshade]

[Sekh765]

You keep saying that we aren't understanding or reading your message right, but this entire thread is becoming highly reminiscent of an earlier thread about a week or two ago.

All your "Pros" written for a votekick option are something the admin staff on these servers deal with on a day to day basis. For the most part they are dealt with quickly and more importantly fairly. We are not going to change our servers to some sort of group/mob ruling system with votekick. I can guarantee you now that votekick will not be implemented on our servers, as it causes far more problems than it helps. Hacking is one of the largest problems with votekick. I know for a fact that multiple players on these servers, many of them my friends who I have played with a long time, get accused of hacking on a regular basis. Now I know these people arn't hacking but that doesn't stop one person from stirring up an entire server against this player.

This is why we will not have a votekick option.

Now. Let me attempt to clarify our spawn camping rules for you, as you seem to not want to read my link, and decided to post my answer and Caigs next to each other in some sort of strange combination or something pointing out some confusing post. Here are the rules, this is what the community agreed on. And again, I post this in hopes that this topic will end, because as Nikky pointed out, this is going in circles.


Core definition: Killing players emerging from a spawn door, no matter how many doors they have before they have a chance to react is considered Spawn camping. This does not include the initial map siege.

In this first section, We are attempting to prevent players from dieing before they know what is behind their doors. Your sentry on E was targeting people less than 1 second outside the door, and that was probably why you were kicked. It doesn't matter that it wasn't pointing DIRECTLY at the door, again, as people pointed out, you placed it so incredibly close that it might as well have been pointed at the door because a single step outside would result in it killing you. This IS spawn camping. These servers are for fun, they are not for super serious play, and we take that into account whenever we write our rules.

Initial spawn siege here refers to maps such as Goldrush, where the entire point of the beginning of the map is to keep the enemy team in their spawn to stop them from getting on the cart.

Secondary definition: Snipers who snipe from within the protective shield of their spawn door are in violation of the spawncamping rule.

This is really not the rule we are talking about but I placed it here for completion. This was ALSO made at our communities request, because we have many very skilled sniper players who would hide next too/inside their door so they could not be killed. Again, this is an example of us doing what the community wanted.

--

This WAS a conversation about spawn camping, but you yourself decided to bring up the topics of running the server/removing most of the admins, without having any prior knowledge to the amount of work we put into just keeping the servers UP. I am sorry to play this card, but you have no idea what our servers require from both the administrative and moderation team to keep them functioning, so asking us to "remove most of the admins" as you say, is laughable at the very least. We have seen servers use votekick, and decided a long time ago that it was not for us. Our COMMUNITY agrees, the one which you claim to speak for, but again, in our experience in dealing with a large portion of them on a day to day basis, I do not believe you are correct.

In the end. It is very very simple. If you THINK you are spawn camping, or it feels you are denying the enemy team their ability to react as they come out of their spawn door. Don't do it! It's easy! Don't be a prick to your fellow players! If you think your only way of defending E is to build a sentry pointed at their door, then FIND ANOTHER WAY! Or build the sentry around a different corner so they have more time to move! Seriously. This is probably the SIMPLEST rule in all of our little 5 page rulebook. 99% of our community has no problem following it.

[Witchiebunny]

I'm growing quite tired of this conversation, so I'll make this simple, and you may consider this my final say on the situation:

The solutions you propose do not work for TFP, for reasons pointed out to you multiple times. They continue not to work for TFP despite the fact that it may work well on other servers. And they will not be implemented because these solutions do not work and no amount of your screaming or crying or insisting that they work will make them magically work for the community nor will it make us change our minds.

If you are so unsatisfied with the rules of this community and server, which are not changing, then feel free to find another server to play on. I do believe TPF, Le Vanilla, Team Furtress and NF to name a few are all up and running with servers to play on. And if those are not to your liking, then find one of these servers you've enjoyed playing on with votekick and go there. But this conversation is going in circles and I'm not letting this grow to a monstrous 8 pages or until you get tired of arguing the point and leave in a huff.

Follow the rules. Failure to do so will get you kicked or banned. Don't like it? Don't play on our servers. End of story.

Topic locked.